I am wary of the groupthink that Biden is unfit. Sorry ALARMED. It worked on our opinion of Hilary, and it works on those who support trump. They will enjoy our casting out of the only one who bested trump. Why else would they target him as they have? And his family. The mobs and gangs go after families. This is who THEY are. Who are you?
I’m not voting for Joe Biden to run a marathon or dig a ditch. His staff and proxies are competent, organized, exceptional. Um. That’s his job. He is not playing the prez on tv.
Joe Biden is our President. Of the United States of America. I would like to exhibit pride of choice. As Joe has stood for our choices.
I am 100% behind Biden. My mom is at the lofty age of 90. She just in the past 2 years has lost her faculties after having a stroke. Biden has Harris behind him if need be, and Jill beside him to help him decide if he is not fit. Everyone who personally talks to him says he is, so these are just right wing media tropes that sell their media when Bidens failings cannot because he is a good president. It is disconcerting that people are conflating campaign performance with governance performance. He has been good so far in the former until the debate which I did not see, but was surprised to hear how unbalanced people sound. Of course, the reality of a second Trump term gets closer, people are getting terrified because we all know we are at the point Germany was at during the Weimar Republic when Hitler was manipulating things to get into absolute power and carry out his depraved agenda. This is a difficult time in the world, and people should be planning every realistic eventuality, and dumping Biden is not one of them. We should be prepared to take action if the Supreme Court joins Trump in staging a coup by handing Trump the election sans him winning it by coming up with some unconstitutional specious argument. They are preparing the American people for that by slowly upping the fascistic nature of their decisions so that there is no connection whatsoever with the Constitution as written, yet we do not try to overthrow the courts. Chillingly, the head of the Heritage Foundation is found to be saying they are in the process of a Second Revolution, which the Guardian tells us they have been trying to implement since Reagan. He goes on to tell us that "it will remain bloodless if the Left allows it to be." He is conflating a still mainstream party the Democrats with "the Left." and threatening violence if we don't accept what they plan to do. Where does the US military fit in with all of this?
Excellent analysis. This is more than Biden v Trump. This is Democracy v Fascism. The media is willing to sell America for 30 pieces of silver. If they think that they will be immune to prosecution by supporting Trump, they face a rude awakening.
Yes, every panicking columnist, editorial board, and pundit obsessing over Biden's debate performance should set their respective egos aside for now and focus on the actual horror that awaits us if Tя☭mp prevails in November. The Supreme Court has permanently altered the electoral landscape with their decision in Tя☭mp v. The United States, and speculation about Biden's fitness for the job is not just stupid, it’s irrelevant.
Fascism will absolutely rule the US if Donald Tя☭mp becomes President again, and we all know that to be true. All of us know that’s the case. He'll be unrestrained in his treason, since the Court has ruled that treason is legal if the President does it. The only choice the electorate has to make in November is between a continuing democracy or the utter chaos and criminality of fascism.
Yes, and guess what? NONE of those columnists and editorial board members have ever run for office or served in elected office. They are, as my 99 year old dad says, "talking through their hats". Harris was my first pick 4 years ago, and Biden was my tenth, but I'm sticking with the team that brought us out of Covid and repaired the economy. Done.
I'm voting for the Blue Team. MSM lost all their credibility when they kissed the ring of their alt-right Billionaires. Are they going Fox on everyone to cover their own ass in case King Shitpants wins?? I've already contacted my Senators this morning about Kevin Roberts threats for war. They want blood. Everyone needs to stop sleep walking around this living threat. They want a Revolution. Kevin's and Leonard Leo's wet dream is to own this country and rule it. The 6 Supreme Court Justices are owned by Leo and his Christofascists Billionaires. It's in the bag!! I feel like I got screwed without my consent.
Stuart Stevens' excellent analysis in The Atlantic lays out how insane it is for Dems to race toward abandoning the president who offers the Democratic Party its chance to scuttle its long reputation as the part of weakness, un-American, with the guy who is the first president ever to visit a country in a hot war (Ukraine) and who reconstituted crucial European and Asian alliances against the emerging Putin / Xi / Kim axis.
Stevens worked on five presidential campaigns, always for Republicans, and he is baffled at Dems' and eager pundits' rush to fling not just Biden but our own advantages off a cliff. I agree. none of the folks hopping up and down, not a one, offer any serious analysis of a plausible plan for how to proceed after kicking the only man who beat Trump off the ticket, just vague, lame lines about how the party won't fracture over this—sure not! and the fantasy (based on what?) that someone/anyone can beat Trump...any old Dem EXCEPT Joe Biden.
this "you can't be serious" look has a point of view I've seen nowhere else. highly recommended, and good to share (but not sure if it's behind a paywall).
Yep. I don’t think the debate was disastrous and I wish people would stop already. Maybe it didn’t live up to some people’s expectations, but that’s their issue to work out in therapy. 😊
Really? It was clearly disastrous, obvious from when he walked onto the stage and confirmed with his confusing answers. Not sure if the low point was the Medicare misquote or when they were bantering about their golf handicap? If he's doing so well, why isn't he out there showing that to us rather than avoiding non-teleprompter appearances over the last 6-12 months?
One thing I haven’t seen in any of the frantic writings about Biden’s debate performance is the comparison to a professional athlete or performer who “chokes.” When that happens, it can set off a cascade of errors. But we don’t generally write off the athlete for a bad game or insist that a musician who makes a mistake resign from performing. We should give Biden the same benefit of the doubt.
Think about the fact that the only thing Republicans and opponents can find to criticize Biden, after 50 years of public service, is that he's old. Keep in mind that US culture hates aging and Biden reminds everyone that we're all getting old. If you want to have some fun Google what Trump would look like without the bronzer, the combover and no long tie (it's used to visually distract from his large stomach). Then imagine that Trump on the debate stage. We have no idea about Trump's health because he refuses to release any information from a competent doctor (Dr. Oz and Ronny Jackson don't count). Why do you think this is? Does Trump have Type 2 diabetes, high blood pressure, high cholesterol, heart problems. We know he does no exercise and has a diet high in fat and salt. Would Trump survive another term? Why aren't pundits calling for a competent doctor's report on Trump's health? But, as always, Republicans are the Borg and pundits don't have any answers so they go for the easy hit. I think after Monday's horrific Supreme Court decision the campaign should focus on which candidate do you trust to not be a dictator (one already admitted he's all in). Thomas Paine, in Common Sense, said that the law is king. Heather Cox Richardson wrote "...a nation should rest not on the arbitrary rule of a single man and his hand-picked advisors, but on the rule of law.”
I've found the recent NYT Opinion consensus on this disorienting and disturbing. It feels like 2016 Twitter where "everyone" agrees, but "everyone" represents some 10% of the US population.
As a point of comparison, the NYT reporting on Russia's invasion of Ukraine has been consistently terrible for over a year now: they're often factually wrong despite excellent resources on real-time developments (e.g., daily analysis from the ISW.org team). It's just a reminder that the NYT, to pick a prominent example, is more in the business of selling eyeballs now than being factually correct.
I don't know. I imagine not one person who is planning to vote for Biden is going to change course because the candidate is Kamala or whoever. They'll still vote for the person with a D next to their name. But it would seem a lot of people who planned to sit out the presidential choice, young people especially who are angry at Biden over Gaza or just put off by his age, would be more enthusiastic about a younger Democratic alternative. That said, voting for Democrats at every level is the only way to stop the fascists so of course I'll be with Biden, not that my vote matters in Montana.
The most compelling response I've heard to this line of reasoning is disagreement and lingering resentments over *which* replacement.
Personal anecdote: I lived in Montana in 2016 and still foster ill-will to the Sanders campaign for prolonging the primary. By not stepping aside and supporting Clinton, Sanders empowered his supporters to attack Clinton and robbed her of momentum and support on the far left. All of which is to say we have recent examples of significant conflict between the Democratic center-left and far-left, even in the face of Trump. Consequently, I remain very skeptical of optimistic forecasts that voters will "close ranks" around a *single* alternative Democratic candidate.
I understand what it is like to live in a Republican controlled state. :( It is not safe to express myself in my area either, so I really appreciate forums like this and the opportunity to share and discuss important things with open minded people.
No worries, I'm all in for Tester and just met with the head of his local office yesterday to see if I can help. I'm all in for any Democrat and I try to make sure I'm voting for sane school board members, it's just that for the presidential race, it's hopeless in this state.
As you said, Noah—the media loves conflict because conflict is a good story. They dislike Biden because he's not "exciting"—he sits down and does his job, quietly and competently, and "The President did exactly what we expected of him in the way we expected it without a fuss" is BO-RING! to the adrenaline junkies who covered Donald Trump and his three-ring circus that was always on fire.
The late unlamented Les Moonves of CBS put it best, "Donald Trump may not be good for America, but he's great for CBS News!" That is the mindset calling for Biden to step down now—don't fall for it, people!
I liken the self-righteous alarm of the pundits over one incident which involved delivery, not substance, to the alarm trump creates when he uses ONE murder by an immigrant to "prove" all immigrants are criminals. It is exactly the same reasoning. One instance, no further evidence needed to draw broad conclusion
Hooray! It is wonderful to read some clear, common sense information about our current situation. I agree with you totally, and THANK YOU for expressing it so clearly! :)
The issue as I see it is that if Biden was doing so well, why isn't he out there showing that to us? He has avoided public appearances over the last 6 months, especially those without a teleprompter. Maybe the upcoming interview with George Stephanopoulos will convince us he is OK...maybe?
I will never understand when teleprompters became the boogie-man. Trump uses one (yes, he does, and when it's not working correctly he sounds more insane than normal), Obama used one; I'm sure most speeches by elected officials or candidates use one. Members of Congress give speeches off sheets of paper. Why are we expecting Biden to memorize everything, when we don't expect that of anyone else?
Dude, can you show us on the doll where the teleprompter hurt you? 🙄 I mean, have you met Joe Biden!? He’s always been the gaffe king, and he has had plenty of recent opportunities to do cringy content for you to obsess over and betch about instead. You just have to look.
I am wary of the groupthink that Biden is unfit. Sorry ALARMED. It worked on our opinion of Hilary, and it works on those who support trump. They will enjoy our casting out of the only one who bested trump. Why else would they target him as they have? And his family. The mobs and gangs go after families. This is who THEY are. Who are you?
I’m not voting for Joe Biden to run a marathon or dig a ditch. His staff and proxies are competent, organized, exceptional. Um. That’s his job. He is not playing the prez on tv.
Joe Biden is our President. Of the United States of America. I would like to exhibit pride of choice. As Joe has stood for our choices.
Excellent!
This is EXACTLY what every single pundit SHOULD be writing, Noah. Thank you.
I am 100% behind Biden. My mom is at the lofty age of 90. She just in the past 2 years has lost her faculties after having a stroke. Biden has Harris behind him if need be, and Jill beside him to help him decide if he is not fit. Everyone who personally talks to him says he is, so these are just right wing media tropes that sell their media when Bidens failings cannot because he is a good president. It is disconcerting that people are conflating campaign performance with governance performance. He has been good so far in the former until the debate which I did not see, but was surprised to hear how unbalanced people sound. Of course, the reality of a second Trump term gets closer, people are getting terrified because we all know we are at the point Germany was at during the Weimar Republic when Hitler was manipulating things to get into absolute power and carry out his depraved agenda. This is a difficult time in the world, and people should be planning every realistic eventuality, and dumping Biden is not one of them. We should be prepared to take action if the Supreme Court joins Trump in staging a coup by handing Trump the election sans him winning it by coming up with some unconstitutional specious argument. They are preparing the American people for that by slowly upping the fascistic nature of their decisions so that there is no connection whatsoever with the Constitution as written, yet we do not try to overthrow the courts. Chillingly, the head of the Heritage Foundation is found to be saying they are in the process of a Second Revolution, which the Guardian tells us they have been trying to implement since Reagan. He goes on to tell us that "it will remain bloodless if the Left allows it to be." He is conflating a still mainstream party the Democrats with "the Left." and threatening violence if we don't accept what they plan to do. Where does the US military fit in with all of this?
Excellent analysis. This is more than Biden v Trump. This is Democracy v Fascism. The media is willing to sell America for 30 pieces of silver. If they think that they will be immune to prosecution by supporting Trump, they face a rude awakening.
Yes, every panicking columnist, editorial board, and pundit obsessing over Biden's debate performance should set their respective egos aside for now and focus on the actual horror that awaits us if Tя☭mp prevails in November. The Supreme Court has permanently altered the electoral landscape with their decision in Tя☭mp v. The United States, and speculation about Biden's fitness for the job is not just stupid, it’s irrelevant.
Fascism will absolutely rule the US if Donald Tя☭mp becomes President again, and we all know that to be true. All of us know that’s the case. He'll be unrestrained in his treason, since the Court has ruled that treason is legal if the President does it. The only choice the electorate has to make in November is between a continuing democracy or the utter chaos and criminality of fascism.
Yes, and guess what? NONE of those columnists and editorial board members have ever run for office or served in elected office. They are, as my 99 year old dad says, "talking through their hats". Harris was my first pick 4 years ago, and Biden was my tenth, but I'm sticking with the team that brought us out of Covid and repaired the economy. Done.
I'm voting for the Blue Team. MSM lost all their credibility when they kissed the ring of their alt-right Billionaires. Are they going Fox on everyone to cover their own ass in case King Shitpants wins?? I've already contacted my Senators this morning about Kevin Roberts threats for war. They want blood. Everyone needs to stop sleep walking around this living threat. They want a Revolution. Kevin's and Leonard Leo's wet dream is to own this country and rule it. The 6 Supreme Court Justices are owned by Leo and his Christofascists Billionaires. It's in the bag!! I feel like I got screwed without my consent.
Stuart Stevens' excellent analysis in The Atlantic lays out how insane it is for Dems to race toward abandoning the president who offers the Democratic Party its chance to scuttle its long reputation as the part of weakness, un-American, with the guy who is the first president ever to visit a country in a hot war (Ukraine) and who reconstituted crucial European and Asian alliances against the emerging Putin / Xi / Kim axis.
Stevens worked on five presidential campaigns, always for Republicans, and he is baffled at Dems' and eager pundits' rush to fling not just Biden but our own advantages off a cliff. I agree. none of the folks hopping up and down, not a one, offer any serious analysis of a plausible plan for how to proceed after kicking the only man who beat Trump off the ticket, just vague, lame lines about how the party won't fracture over this—sure not! and the fantasy (based on what?) that someone/anyone can beat Trump...any old Dem EXCEPT Joe Biden.
this "you can't be serious" look has a point of view I've seen nowhere else. highly recommended, and good to share (but not sure if it's behind a paywall).
Here’s that article in The Atlantic (thanks for the recommendation)
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2024/07/antidemocratic-uprising-against-joe-biden/678865/
but the list of current articles show many calling for Biden to step aside so I can’t promote The Atlantic overall.
Yep. I don’t think the debate was disastrous and I wish people would stop already. Maybe it didn’t live up to some people’s expectations, but that’s their issue to work out in therapy. 😊
Really? It was clearly disastrous, obvious from when he walked onto the stage and confirmed with his confusing answers. Not sure if the low point was the Medicare misquote or when they were bantering about their golf handicap? If he's doing so well, why isn't he out there showing that to us rather than avoiding non-teleprompter appearances over the last 6-12 months?
One thing I haven’t seen in any of the frantic writings about Biden’s debate performance is the comparison to a professional athlete or performer who “chokes.” When that happens, it can set off a cascade of errors. But we don’t generally write off the athlete for a bad game or insist that a musician who makes a mistake resign from performing. We should give Biden the same benefit of the doubt.
Think about the fact that the only thing Republicans and opponents can find to criticize Biden, after 50 years of public service, is that he's old. Keep in mind that US culture hates aging and Biden reminds everyone that we're all getting old. If you want to have some fun Google what Trump would look like without the bronzer, the combover and no long tie (it's used to visually distract from his large stomach). Then imagine that Trump on the debate stage. We have no idea about Trump's health because he refuses to release any information from a competent doctor (Dr. Oz and Ronny Jackson don't count). Why do you think this is? Does Trump have Type 2 diabetes, high blood pressure, high cholesterol, heart problems. We know he does no exercise and has a diet high in fat and salt. Would Trump survive another term? Why aren't pundits calling for a competent doctor's report on Trump's health? But, as always, Republicans are the Borg and pundits don't have any answers so they go for the easy hit. I think after Monday's horrific Supreme Court decision the campaign should focus on which candidate do you trust to not be a dictator (one already admitted he's all in). Thomas Paine, in Common Sense, said that the law is king. Heather Cox Richardson wrote "...a nation should rest not on the arbitrary rule of a single man and his hand-picked advisors, but on the rule of law.”
I've found the recent NYT Opinion consensus on this disorienting and disturbing. It feels like 2016 Twitter where "everyone" agrees, but "everyone" represents some 10% of the US population.
As a point of comparison, the NYT reporting on Russia's invasion of Ukraine has been consistently terrible for over a year now: they're often factually wrong despite excellent resources on real-time developments (e.g., daily analysis from the ISW.org team). It's just a reminder that the NYT, to pick a prominent example, is more in the business of selling eyeballs now than being factually correct.
They’ve always been like this. We see it more now. Remember their breathless repeating of wmd in iraq? Which was easily disprovable at the time.
And nonstop Hillary’s emails articles?
That too. Or their praise for Hitler in the 30’s.
I don't know. I imagine not one person who is planning to vote for Biden is going to change course because the candidate is Kamala or whoever. They'll still vote for the person with a D next to their name. But it would seem a lot of people who planned to sit out the presidential choice, young people especially who are angry at Biden over Gaza or just put off by his age, would be more enthusiastic about a younger Democratic alternative. That said, voting for Democrats at every level is the only way to stop the fascists so of course I'll be with Biden, not that my vote matters in Montana.
The most compelling response I've heard to this line of reasoning is disagreement and lingering resentments over *which* replacement.
Personal anecdote: I lived in Montana in 2016 and still foster ill-will to the Sanders campaign for prolonging the primary. By not stepping aside and supporting Clinton, Sanders empowered his supporters to attack Clinton and robbed her of momentum and support on the far left. All of which is to say we have recent examples of significant conflict between the Democratic center-left and far-left, even in the face of Trump. Consequently, I remain very skeptical of optimistic forecasts that voters will "close ranks" around a *single* alternative Democratic candidate.
I understand what it is like to live in a Republican controlled state. :( It is not safe to express myself in my area either, so I really appreciate forums like this and the opportunity to share and discuss important things with open minded people.
It does count! We need to keep Senator Tester in the Senate!
No worries, I'm all in for Tester and just met with the head of his local office yesterday to see if I can help. I'm all in for any Democrat and I try to make sure I'm voting for sane school board members, it's just that for the presidential race, it's hopeless in this state.
I hate hate hate how this method of voting does that to voters. It’s alienating.
As you said, Noah—the media loves conflict because conflict is a good story. They dislike Biden because he's not "exciting"—he sits down and does his job, quietly and competently, and "The President did exactly what we expected of him in the way we expected it without a fuss" is BO-RING! to the adrenaline junkies who covered Donald Trump and his three-ring circus that was always on fire.
The late unlamented Les Moonves of CBS put it best, "Donald Trump may not be good for America, but he's great for CBS News!" That is the mindset calling for Biden to step down now—don't fall for it, people!
I liken the self-righteous alarm of the pundits over one incident which involved delivery, not substance, to the alarm trump creates when he uses ONE murder by an immigrant to "prove" all immigrants are criminals. It is exactly the same reasoning. One instance, no further evidence needed to draw broad conclusion
Hooray! It is wonderful to read some clear, common sense information about our current situation. I agree with you totally, and THANK YOU for expressing it so clearly! :)
Thank you. I keep saying we don’t need ANOTHER contested dem convention in Chicago.
Couldn’t agree more. The media behavior is a disgrace.
Best advice ever - stick with BIDEN!!
The issue as I see it is that if Biden was doing so well, why isn't he out there showing that to us? He has avoided public appearances over the last 6 months, especially those without a teleprompter. Maybe the upcoming interview with George Stephanopoulos will convince us he is OK...maybe?
I will never understand when teleprompters became the boogie-man. Trump uses one (yes, he does, and when it's not working correctly he sounds more insane than normal), Obama used one; I'm sure most speeches by elected officials or candidates use one. Members of Congress give speeches off sheets of paper. Why are we expecting Biden to memorize everything, when we don't expect that of anyone else?
Wow. Two replies from you about teleprompters.
Dude, can you show us on the doll where the teleprompter hurt you? 🙄 I mean, have you met Joe Biden!? He’s always been the gaffe king, and he has had plenty of recent opportunities to do cringy content for you to obsess over and betch about instead. You just have to look.
Actually, I've seen Joe multiple times as I live in Delaware. He has clearly declined as many do when they hit 80+